See how the farmer waits for the precious fruit of the earth, being patient with it until it receives the early and the late rains. - James 5:7

Sunday, August 21, 2011

More Mass Chat: More things I don't get.



American Imperialism:
 I can not understand how or why the United States Government believes it has the authority to oust the leaders of other sovereign nations?  One by one we are picking off leaders we don't like or want - Saddam Hussein is one debate, but now it is Lybia's Gadhafi, Syria's Assad, who's next? 
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Comment found at Fr. Z's Litany against Internet Trolls:
  • From my inability to grasp that the Novus Ordo Mass is harmful to souls, deliver me O Lord!
  • From my inability to accept that Vatican II is in discontinuity with Tradition, deliver me O Lord!
  • From my inability to admit that Pope Benedict’s ecumenism goes a bit too far, deliver me O Lord.
The commenter left a smiley face, but is it a joke - or is that what people are being told?  I think it is the latter.

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The Irish bishop saying 'children of divorce are born losers' - or something like that:
Actually - when I read the whole thing - I understood what the bishop meant - nevertheless, it is the headline statement that will be remembered.  Another like it is the American bishop's statement regarding unrepentant pro-abortion politicians and public dissenters from Catholic teaching; 'treat them like tax collectors'.  Again - reading the entire statement one understands what the bishop is saying - however, the headline is what sticks and is repeated and is promulgated.
Those attitudes correspond to similar attitudes I experienced as a kid in Catholic grade school.  My mother was divorced and remarried to my dad.  I had 2 older siblings.  My parents were drinkers and brawlers and poor.  Some of the nuns, indeed, some of the priests and fellow Catholics, treated us that way - born losers and tax collectors.  I'm not complaining - just stating a fact.  Fortunately Christ welcomed sinners and ate with tax-collectors and born losers.
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That's all.  I thought I had more but I guess not.
  

26 comments:

  1. Go over a listen to Thin Lizzie on my blog Terry..will perk u up!

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  3. I thought that headline was dreadful too.

    People make mistakes and bishops are people. Wish he had been more prudent because there are a lot of people out there who are from one-parent families who won't go past the headline.

    What the bishops need to be doing is leading the effort to discuss things like co-habitation and urge their priests to do the same from the pulpit. I know many young Catholics who just come to Mass every Sunday and go about life. I've heard stories about how some are shocked when they go in to get married and learn they ought not be living together. Why is that the first time they hear it as opposed to once or twice a year in the pew?

    Ok - not all go every Sunday. But word will get around when priests finally start talking about it. God bless those who already do.

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  4. I'll keep my opinion of whether writing such a litany, whether in jest or not, is the best use of creativity. But for some of the folks who inhabit that blog, anyone who dares disagree with them is a troll. The first time I ever left a comment there, I was accused of being that very thing. Hard to see anything Christ-like in any of it.

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  5. I had to track down the article before I could make a comment.

    Might I remind everyone that the bishop did not write the title of the article. If he was quoted correctly (which I have not verified) what he said was perfectly in line with truth.

    Terry - there was plenty of dysfunction in my home as well and all I can say is, "Look how great we both turned out." That being said, I would trade my "growing up drama" for Leave It To Beaver any day. It might not have taken until age 45 to start to wise up.

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  7. When despicable leaders do despicable thing to their own people, it is the world's responsibility to remove them. We can not just sit back and wring our hands and say "Oh well--that is thousands of miles away and doesn't involve ME." And yes it often involves militaries and guns. The UN needs more support in these endeavors. We cannot hide our heads in the sand and permit another Hitler to happen...

    Shadowlands--I'll buy ya a Roy Rogers and I'll sit by ya next to the spider plant :) Plese bring some DECENT English scones...the US ones are just terrible.. :) Although we DO have a decent English fish-n-chips place in town with REAL chips--not french fries...

    Sara

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  9. @ Sara, so if the world determines that whoever the Americans choose as their President is somehow hurting his people, the rest of the world has the right to come in an initiate a "regime change."

    Be careful what "rights" you take upon yourself, others might take them as well.

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  10. Puff--US presidents usually do not starve or murder or use chemical weapons against their own countrymen..our presidents are pretty benevolent when compared to the likes of Saddam Hussein, Idi Amin, Slobodan Milosevic, Pol Pot, etc..

    And US voters are pretty good about their own "regime change" every 4-8 years anyway..I think we're in for one next fall..

    Sara

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  11. @ Sara

    That isn't what I am saying, I am not saying that your presidents' need to be changed by outside forces, I am saying what if in some fluke situation, the rest of the world thinks/believes/ is absolutely possitive that your president is bad for you or should not be theman to has control of nuclear weapons. Does the rest of the whole world, with or without the UN have the right to come in and "save you?" If the UN and the US have the right to save other nations, does that mean that other Nations with the UN have the right to "save you"

    As for the assertion that your government is NOT hostile to American citizens and would hurt them, I list two things you should google, there are more, but start with those.

    Agent Orange and
    The Teskegee Experiments



    Google Agent Orange, and the Teskegee Experiments

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  12. Sara, with all due respect, you give the UN too much credit, assuming they would do ANYTHING to really alleviate problems if they were given more power. Your errr is in assuming that nations ad governments really are after peace and freedom as general goods and will work towards that end.

    You ever see who sits on the UN human rights council? You ever wonder why the ( admittedly) inhuambe things done by the Israelis are condemned at every turn, but not a peep is said about the horrid things done daily in other places by other culprits? You know about the OIC, the largest bloc in the UN? Have you ever heard of the bloody and constant persecution of Christians being condemned in the UN? Ever hear of the radibly anti- Christian and secularist plans of the convention for the rights of the child? Or the women's rights organizations in the UN?

    And organization that selectively decides who and what need be condemned - where democratic and freely elected governments have the same rights as despotic and tyrannical ones - such an organization deserves no more power, an in fact, like the EU and the European Court of Human rights, I'd love to see much of their power taken away.

    And Assad will be gone, and what will follow him will be worse. Same goes for Libya and Egypt. Tyranny breeds nothing better than radicalism and fundamentalism. These are not "freedom" movements. The US government's biggest mistake has been to assume that people the world over truly want the same things. Ask the Christians of Uraq how that turned out.

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  13. Puff those things are true, but such things can also e said of the Vritish, Canadian, French, Australian, etc. Governments. Horrible and reprehensible and good reasons why we should never fully trust Caesar's benevolence.

    But compared to the routine, sustained and violet oppression known daily by people in Syria, Lybia, North Korea, Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc., it's a stretch. Were Gallic about places and people who are only in power because of evil and violence.

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  14. Clark - I removed it - but then you are SD? Because that is who sent me his name. What up with that?

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  15. I'm sorry this came to a head on your blog of all places, but needed to call someone out on their "stuff." Please remove your 5:39 comment as it still contains his name. I came for the Catholic content, but my stalker followed me in. He is going by way more than Andrew, btw... An email is forthcoming and I'm done discussing this here.

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  16. Mercury--I'll agree that the UN is not the best solution...I was over in Kuwait after the first Gulf War "observing" the UN "Oil for food" debacle that was eventually revealled for the corruption that it really was. And I was not permitted to report what I saw as we were only there to keep the shipments of rotten food, expired baby formula and medicines, and wheat full of weavils from getting stolen..

    But unfortunately the UN is what we have....as was mentioned the EU isn't much better...but if the US and maybe a couple of close allies were to join together, then we would be accused of "imperialism"...which is why we did not sack Bagdad during the first Gulf War even though we were less than 20 miles and counting..

    I don't know what the solution is, but trying SOMETHING is better than standing back and doing nothing..even if it means military escorts to ensure food aid is gettinbg where it needs to go...but yes you remove corrupt governments and then there exists a vacuum as most learned peoples are either dead or have fled...no easy answers

    Sara

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  17. Clark I removed it - but the names are added to my list of anonymous commenters.

    What I told you still stands however - "sell crazy someplace else - we're all stocked up here."

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  18. Puff those things are true, but such things can also e said of the Vritish, Canadian, French, Australian, etc. Governments. Horrible and reprehensible and good reasons why we should never fully trust Caesar's benevolence.

    But compared to the routine, sustained and violet oppression known daily by people in Syria, Lybia, North Korea, Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc., it's a stretch. Were Gallic about places and people who are only in power because of evil and violence.

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  19. Terry, what if there's a really good sale on crazy? Like a two-for-one deal? Would you want some then?

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  20. Sara, I understand your concern.

    Who knows what to do with such situations? Though if it weren't so terrible it's be almost funny how all the Europeans who pissed and moaned about the US involvement in Iraq were so quick to jump right in when it came to Libya.

    Hypocrisy, anyone?

    In any event, both the UN and the EU are openly hostile to religion, especially to the Catholic Church. Unfortunately, so are most NGOs involved in "human rights".

    Th European Court of Human Rights should be seriously shut down and ignored.

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  21. Wow...this place can get a liitle crazy. Terry, maybe you need to turn off comments for a day ( similar to a fast) and just let us sit in the silence of your blog and your commentary.

    I would like to think that commenter on WDTPRS was joking and sarcastic, but we all know that's not happening. That blog could use some humor now and then. And I'm not talking about his cooking comments or his plea for birdseed. What?!

    Anne (who is creeping back to her comfy seat in the corner)

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  22. I don't think much of the Litany but then I am not a Fr. Z fan, not a place where I would tread. Far too much arrogance and sarcasm for me.
    You really aren't welcome over there unless you are a man who embraces the TLM big time, and consider yourself to be a very good armchair Canon Lawyer.

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  23. And for some of them it gotta be the 1917 code, because the 1983 one is "tainted with modernism".

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  24. Once again, I missed the crazy comments after they've already been deleted. I feel like the kid in school who's always the last to get invited to the party! :-P

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  25. A Random Friar9:44 PM

    I tend toward a more "conservative" political bent (I call myself more of a "classical liberal"). But it's amazing how much one's siding politically can throw up blinders.

    Our current president has won the Nobel Prize, essentially for "not being Bush." He was awarded an award for transparency in politics, no joking, in a private, unpublicized ceremony away from the media. The powers that Bush had assumed in the War on Terror were horrible...until Obama came to power, then they were great, even when he went beyond Bush ("kinetic military action?")

    Of course, if the Republicans had removed their blinders before Obama came to power, they would not be decrying Obama's use of the same tools Bush had.

    The true progressives that are disappointed in Obama's continuing wars and initiating sustained military "non-wars" and protest against him have my respect. It is so hard to find those who really follow ideals rather than political bedfellows.

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  26. Sometimes, after seeing the stuff that goes on blogger, I'm glad I have just a humble little blog in the corner of nowhere. ;0)

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Please comment with charity and avoid ad hominem attacks. I exercise the right to delete comments I find inappropriate. If you use your real name there is a better chance your comment will stay put.